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Airline CEOs Try Out Coach
American CEO Doug Parker, and Delta CEO Ed Bastian, agreed to spend some time in their coach cabins to discuss traveler complaints about cramped conditions. (www.wsj.com) Altro...Sort type: [Top] [Newest]
Folks brace yourselves for what is coming. Over the past few years the airlines made tons of money, really tons and yet they squeezed more seats into the economy section, but now that the cost of fuel has gone up, it is not an educated guess but an outright affirmation that more seats will be shoehorned into the economy section so if your waistline is a bit roundier, you will have to cough up more dimes for the wider seats.
I would like to think this is unlikely. Consumers, powered with instagram and twitter, won’t accept this escalation any more. Also, the airlines are not necessarily impacted immediately by fuel price hikes because they hedge on crude when the demand is down. Also, airlines are investing in better, more efficient aircraft and are doing it largely through lease programs so they are actually consuming less with a fixed cost of ownership. Unless something in the industry changes drastically, like an oil spill, a major safety discovery, or new sweeping regulation, costs should stay steady for airlines and consumers alike.
FYI American Airlines just deferred the delivery of 25 fuel efficient 320NEOs until 2019 and 5 787s until year 2019 citing high fuel costs. Watch for the other airlines doing the same thing.
I was unable to "open" the entire article as well. but I understand what the story is about..airline employees are told by their local supervisors or management to expect the ceo or whomever to be flying on the flight they are working,whether they are a flight attendant or a ground person..rampers are told to really clean the aircraft from seats to floors,flight attendants are told to have everything neat and tidy on the cart,and of course the flight deck crew is advised..upper level management rarely,if ever make surprise visits,or fly unexpectedly..rumor had it that when braniff was still active as a trunk carrie,rthe ceo of the airline had the entire first class cabin to himself,without even passengers allowed! (as I said,rumor from past years!)the point is, the sentence above says parker and bastian "agreed to spend some time in their coach cabins to discuss travel complaints about cramped conditions"...I am wondering if they were seated in a 3 across section with a middle seat and a third person reading a newspaper,"just to get the feel"!someone here mentioned southwest having dne tis all the time..in the past their ceo was known to visit onboard with crews an passengers as well to get a firsthand look and feel..but..southwest has never had a first class cabin, and their seating has remained the same on their 737's for years..seat pitch,middle seats and all..rest assured if the ceo of southwest did a "meet and greet" onboard,he did not sit in a passenger seat,unless it was the first row !
At a little over 6'2", and a high leg-to-torso ratio, I'm on the far side of the bell curve for seat design. Add to that that I'm over 50, so cartilage is just a memory in some places.
I completely disagree with any requirement for seat size that isn't essential to passenger safety.
I'm a pretty frequent traveler, and fortunate enough to be able to cough up the extra bucks for a seat with some more legroom (or the exit row, if I'm feeling downright decadent). But there are also times when we have to watch our budget.
A couple such times, I've taken a flight using a certain airline's "teaser" fare - the no-frills one where you don't get an assigned seat, not even allowed a carry-on. Because of that, I was able, in one case, to just call up my mom halfway across the country, and ask if she wanted to go out to dinner. I got a round-trip ticket for under $140, including all taxes, on a flight that was leaving in 90 minutes.
The security fees, facility charges, and taxes meant the actual amount the airline was getting was something like $43 each way, for an 1,100-mile flight.
That's an unreal bargain. In the early 80's, the heyday of airlines like People Express and other no-frills airline, that same ticket was $210. With inflation, that's $550 in present-day dollars.
Airline travel is the great equalizer. It means that someone who hears about an opportunity a thousand miles can afford to take a gamble on what could be "the big break". It means that if I want to see my mom on a whim, it's less than I'd spend on a good dinner for two.
The market has spoken. We want a la carte pricing and options for all budgets. When I need to travel cheap, I can. When I've had a good month and that upgrade to first class is something I can swallow, I can do that too.
Yes, the really small seats are uncomfortable and that *&^%$# metal bar in the seat back pocket digs right into the thin skin at the front of my tibia. But we're talking about an uncomfortable seat for a few hours, not surgery without anesthesia.
I completely disagree with any requirement for seat size that isn't essential to passenger safety.
I'm a pretty frequent traveler, and fortunate enough to be able to cough up the extra bucks for a seat with some more legroom (or the exit row, if I'm feeling downright decadent). But there are also times when we have to watch our budget.
A couple such times, I've taken a flight using a certain airline's "teaser" fare - the no-frills one where you don't get an assigned seat, not even allowed a carry-on. Because of that, I was able, in one case, to just call up my mom halfway across the country, and ask if she wanted to go out to dinner. I got a round-trip ticket for under $140, including all taxes, on a flight that was leaving in 90 minutes.
The security fees, facility charges, and taxes meant the actual amount the airline was getting was something like $43 each way, for an 1,100-mile flight.
That's an unreal bargain. In the early 80's, the heyday of airlines like People Express and other no-frills airline, that same ticket was $210. With inflation, that's $550 in present-day dollars.
Airline travel is the great equalizer. It means that someone who hears about an opportunity a thousand miles can afford to take a gamble on what could be "the big break". It means that if I want to see my mom on a whim, it's less than I'd spend on a good dinner for two.
The market has spoken. We want a la carte pricing and options for all budgets. When I need to travel cheap, I can. When I've had a good month and that upgrade to first class is something I can swallow, I can do that too.
Yes, the really small seats are uncomfortable and that *&^%$# metal bar in the seat back pocket digs right into the thin skin at the front of my tibia. But we're talking about an uncomfortable seat for a few hours, not surgery without anesthesia.
I don't disagree with you, but is the ratio correct? Are the airlines forcing more passengers in the economy coach seats than the market demands? Are they doing it because more pax at lower dollars is better than fewer pax at higher dollars? Are they doing it because airports can only accommodate so many planes on the ramp in certain windows of time? Are they doing it because premium is only premium if there are more peasants in the back of the bus? Are they doing it because they have gross margin minimums for each revenue flight? I think it's a combination of all of these things which make it a magical calculation for the airlines. Revenue minus cost equals gross margin, so more sardines in the can means more revenue with less cost. With that math, there is no way the airlines will be able to right-size the ratio of economy to premium without losing profitability.
That's a lotta questions there, but I think you're right about most of the answers too.
A friend of mine worked for a company that did analytics for airlines so they could price out their flights and plan schedules. The math made orbital calculations look like childs play. But you're probably right - it's "all of the above".
I think there's one more factor too - air travel is like phone or internet service - it's a pure commodity. Unless you have something to differentiate it - like a cheaper price but you can only use so many minutes (or you have to walk past all the leather recliners, then the roomy seats with lots of storage and power outlets, to the ones where your body will fit, even if it ain't happy about it).
I don't think there's a perfect ratio or answer, and I think that even if there was one that solved for today, we'd need a slightly different answer a month later. Or on a different route. Because the economy changed 1%, or competitors came up with some promo that causes you to lose a lot of your low-fare customers. Or tax policy changes on business expenses and you have to freak out about how it will affect the 15% of customers who account for 50% of revenue, vs. the 5% who account for 20%, because a little bleed-off there kills you.
I think the airline industry is a fascinating business and as a pilot and total nerd about anything technical, what's not to love? But I don't think I could ever work for one. I hate being at the mercy of so many forces over which I have zero control.
A friend of mine worked for a company that did analytics for airlines so they could price out their flights and plan schedules. The math made orbital calculations look like childs play. But you're probably right - it's "all of the above".
I think there's one more factor too - air travel is like phone or internet service - it's a pure commodity. Unless you have something to differentiate it - like a cheaper price but you can only use so many minutes (or you have to walk past all the leather recliners, then the roomy seats with lots of storage and power outlets, to the ones where your body will fit, even if it ain't happy about it).
I don't think there's a perfect ratio or answer, and I think that even if there was one that solved for today, we'd need a slightly different answer a month later. Or on a different route. Because the economy changed 1%, or competitors came up with some promo that causes you to lose a lot of your low-fare customers. Or tax policy changes on business expenses and you have to freak out about how it will affect the 15% of customers who account for 50% of revenue, vs. the 5% who account for 20%, because a little bleed-off there kills you.
I think the airline industry is a fascinating business and as a pilot and total nerd about anything technical, what's not to love? But I don't think I could ever work for one. I hate being at the mercy of so many forces over which I have zero control.